Ok Slimland, I have thought about this a little more and here is my answer.

I think we have rule over it in the OT and also now.

James 1:13-15

When tempted, no one should say "God is tempting me," For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone; but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed. Then after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death.

Now, go back earlier in Ch 1 and James opens his letter this way....

Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance. Perseverance must finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything.

Now a couple of important notes here....in the NIV Study Bible it say that the same Greek root used here for "trials" also in the word "tempted" which indicates they are interchangeable terms. So is James saying that when faced with temptation we should consider it joy because is in itself is an exercising of the muscles of our faith? I believe in short that is what he is saying.

But, he is clear that God is not the one doing the tempting. Maybe that is what James is refering to in .vs 5 when he says...

"If any of you lacks wisdom, he should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to him."

..and further

"But when he asks, he must believe and not doubt, because he who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind."

in these verses is James saying, in short....You will be tempted to sin by your own evil desires, but even though this temptation is not from God it should make you happy, because when you fight and rule over this desire it makes you stronger for the next fight and makes the next fight with desire a little easier. But when you feel overwhelmed by this desire ask God for help to remember where the desire came from and that it is not from Him. Otherwise you will be left with the wrong idea that somehow it was sent by God to you for some reason.

Notes in the NIV Study Bible indicate that James' original thought may have been comparing the trials and temptations between a rich and poor man. However, the desires brought on by other temptations to sin could very well be interchangeable here.

Verse 12 seems to give us the final outcome when we are successful at ruling over that temptation which says, "blessed is the man who perseveres under trial, because when he has stood the test, he will receive the crown of life that God has promised to those who love Him.." This is another restatement of Jesus saying.."if you love me...keep my commandments..."

Long answer to say that yes, we have rule over it, just as Eve could have not eaten the fruit, Cain not killed Able, and so on. But while God is not the source of the temptation He has it in his plan to use it to improve us. And with His help we can overcome and rule over it.

Ok, what do you think?

 

Hey Slim,

What translation do you quote scripture from?

The King James Version says "shalt", the New American Standard and the New International Version say "must". That is quite different than "should".

 

I must say Redeemed, that was an awsome answer! If I can expound-- I would say that the temptation is that of the Law IMOP, because if it wern't for the Law we wouldn't be tempted, because we would not no any diffrent. This is why Paul says "That wich is sinful, through the knowlege of the Law, now it becomes exceedinly sinful" {Paraphrased}

So I guess in a sense we never handed our athority of to Lucifer, because the way I understand it -- is if we did then we couldn't rule over it. :?
Does that make sense?

 

I usual use the NKJ, but I have been known to use the KJ.

What I do is if there is something that don't click, I use a concordnance that has Greek and Hebrew, then look at the context of the chapter and book. Usualy after that I can see what is being said. So wich ever book is in context and flows with the subject, that is usualy the one I use.
I have found that the NKJ, Most of the time is in tune, but I have also found this in the New American Standard. They are prety close. But befor I go to the Concordnance I will also go to the Old KJ, then compare!

 

Slimland,

I am going off topic for the moment. I have been at the hospital for most of the day today. My mother suffers from congestive heart failure and just within the last few days she has taken a turn for the worst. The doctor met with me, my brothers, and sister to discuss what to do.

Unless the new medication she is on helps regulate her heart then she will most likely be gone by the end of the week. We had to make a very difficult decision today for the hospital not to take extra measures to bring her back if her heart stops.

This year has been very difficult for me on so many levels. Yet, at the end of the year with the holidays coming up, it looks as if God is going to take my mother. I know God will not give me more than I can carry but I long past what I thought I could handle.

 

I feel your pain, and do understand what you are saying!
The trials never stop, and just when you think you are getting a break here comes another. I sorry to hear about your mom, Absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

Death does not realy bother me, it is life that is hard. The only thing that realy bothers me of death is the pain, befor the death.

A for God givving you more than you can carry. Somtimes I feel as if I should have huge arms and shoulders, because He can surly pile it on!

 

Slimland,

Do not give up on me. Between work and spending time with my mom in the hospital I am trying to research those guys you posted about earlier. I have searched Henry Groover and found little to go on to start with.

Mom is hanging on. This time last week the doctors made us believe she would not last a couple of days. Today she looks better than she has since going into the hospital. I know a full recovery is not possible but any extra time now....especially with the holidays....is a miracle.

 

I have not givven up on ya! I have been real busy myself, but I will PM you soon to tell you what happened to me the other night!

 

I have been thinking of Iraq and somthing popped into my memory. I wonder Redeemed if what, what is going on over there, if it is not or is explained in the following. :? And again it is Zecharaih

Zechariah 5:5-11

5 Then the angel who talked with me came out and said to me, “Lift your eyes now, and see what this is that goes forth.”
6 So I asked, “What is it?” And he said, “It is a basket that is going forth.”
He also said, “This is their resemblance throughout the earth: 7 Here is a lead disc lifted up, and this is a woman sitting inside the basket”; 8 then he said, “This is Wickedness!” And he thrust her down into the basket, and threw the lead cover over its mouth. 9 Then I raised my eyes and looked, and there were two women, coming with the wind in their wings; for they had wings like the wings of a stork, and they lifted up the basket between earth and heaven.
10 So I said to the angel who talked with me, “Where are they carrying the basket?”
11 And he said to me, “To build a house for it in the land of Shinar; when it is ready, the basket will be set there on its base.”

 

Redeemed: If I may interject here. It is somewhat a misnomer or misunderstanding to believe that God will not give us more than WE can bear (alone.)

If you'll study that scripture you will see that the context is that God is there to support us. All things are possible with God. It may not say it, but it is implied that IF you place your burdens on God, and let him support you, he will not give you more than the two of you together can bear.

If you try to bear the iminent passing of your mother without his help, it will overburden you. But, if you stand on the strength of his love, compassion and divine purpose, you will feel a calm and a release that ONLY his love can justify and explain.

Your mother's tribulation is coming to an end. Her reward is waiting for her in Heaven. It is said that God AND all the angels are rejoicing in her coming home to them! What a glorious moment for HER, as well as all the hosts of heaven. Can it be any less glorious for you?

It is all part of God's glorious plan, and since you are one of his strongest believers, He will abide with you awhile to help you through it. If your mother is as much a believer as you, it is what SHE wants and has lived for. I'm not saying you should be happy about it, but it IS proof of what you believe! The knowledge that she will be instantly with God and the angels in heaven should reinforce your belief in the loving redemption of the Lord. And strengthen your resolve to join her when your time comes.

My father (a minister) has always insisted that when he is gone, we should not grieve one moment over his earthly remains, for his REAL self, his spirit, is alive with God, and will always be around us. There is NO victory in the grave.... no sting to death. It is but a momentary shedding of Earthly burdens, and an eternal freedom of the soul "redeemed."

She will not be "gone" from you. She is gone from you now. But, in that moment, she will be all around you! As vibrant and alive as you ever knew her to be! It will be the true test of your faith if you can trust the Lord and believe that, and give Him the glory for it!

I pray for you, at this time, the peace that passes all understanding. And the grace of our Lord that will sustain and empower you. From what I know of you from this board, you definitely qualify as " ye good and faithful servant. " And I KNOW for a fact, that that affords you all the grace, love and blessings that Heaven can bestow.

May God bless you and all your family at this time and for all time.

Hobo